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Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

For the modern ones among us.
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JerryPH
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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by JerryPH » Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:47 am

Glenn wrote:Oh by the way, is the bk7m set up to "understand" the bellows expression?
In other words are the patches set to interpret the bellows expression in a useful way?
I can promise you that it is, but not all parts of it (ie: not the drums), just the parts that are "mapped" to the BK (UP1, UP2, etc.). Remember one of those things that drove me crazy trying to find it? This was specifically the one thing that I did not want, I wanted a steady volume, at least initially, and searched high and low on how to disable it. The answer wasn't in the BK, but in the 8X, where settings had to be disabled. :)
Matt Butcher wrote:Thank you very much Jerry, that's amazing, and I'm a bit worried now because you mentioned all the big projects you had on, I hope this didn't keep you up late! Very much appreciated, and I think I can understand it... Now, when I get a minute, to sit down and try something.
I lost 20 minutes of sleep, no biggie in this case as it was a pleasure. :)

I am typing this at 4:45am as I am waiting for the coffee to finish brewing before getting ready for work, so again, no interference.
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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JerryPH
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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by JerryPH » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:08 am

artelagro wrote:I have an Atlantic that has electric contacts on all the 12 bass notes, each leading to a printed circuit board which contains a microphone, a number of electronic components, some form of rotary controller and a 5-pin DIN socket. Nothing electrical on the keyboard side.
Without seeing it, I am hard pressed to tell you with certainty everything it is, but as a minimum, it looks like an older connection to a proprietary expander and mic outputs. I don't think it is a MIDI out, even though a MIDI does indeed use a 5-pin DIN plug.
artelagro wrote:I also have a rather basic Yamaha keyboard that has a similar socket marked 'MIDI'.
Now, what do I do. Should I buy a connecting cable or accept that this is old junk that is fit only for the bin.
I don't think you should risk it, I don't think your accordion is MIDI equipped, and if you like the sound of this accordion, it is far from being ready for the bin. :)
artelagro wrote:On my other accordion there is nothing electrical on the bass side but there are two microphones on the keyboard side. These go through volume control (?) knobs and terminate with a 1/4" socket similar to an electric guitar.
This is a basic amplification system. I am pretty sure that there is a place somewhere where you plug in a 9-volt battery that powers this setup and would let you plug in to an amplifier.
artelagro wrote:To say I am out of my depth is an understatement.
We all start from the same level, nothing wrong with that. :)
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by artelagro » Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:00 pm

Matt, my apologies for temporarily taking over your post.
Once I manage to shrink the photos, all should become clear.
Jerry, you will soon be able to take the blindfold off. Be patient
Garth

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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by Matt Butcher » Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:52 pm

Garth, no problem at all, the aim of my post was to ask generally, how do you find out about this stuff, and what you're asking ties right in with that theme. The stuff about my weekend was just setting the scene.

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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by Alan Sharkis » Mon Apr 24, 2017 6:02 pm

As several responders suggested, and I wish to reiterate:

1. It is imperative that you know which midi channels the accordion's controller sends information on. This can vary.
For example: Roland send treble on Channel 1, bass on Channel 2, and chords on Channel 3, BUT Master, SEM Ciao reedless, and perhaps many others send treble on Channel 1, bass on channel 3, and chords on channel 2.) Some midi controllers use two treble channels for different purposes.

2. It is also imperative that you know which midi channels the expander or arranger receive information on. It also is important to know what starts a rhythm: bass, chords, pedal,or a combination. Some arrangers, even software arrangers, can have controls for start and stop, intro, ending, break(s), etc., which may either be pedal controlled, controlled from the arranger or expander's panel, or both.

3. If you are recording midi (not audio; there's a difference) into a midi sequencer or DAW, be aware that the code CC11, which is midi for expression or volume, may be transmitted as a continuous stream of CC11's from the bellows, and depending on your computer's specs and the program you are using, and that stream may then overload the program. In that case you have several alternatives:

a. Consider audio recording, which may be difficult to edit later as compared with midi recording.

b. If the software allows you to filter out the CC11's, try that. The recording will have no dynamic expression, but you
can add that later by changing the velocities of individual notes.

c. If the software doesn't allow you to filter out the CC11's there are hardware products from Midi Solutions or Kenton
that can be programmed to do the filtering. I don't remember how the Kenton unit is powered or where it goes in the
midi line, but the Midi Solutions units (Event Processor or Event Processor Plus) can go anywhere in the midi line and
take their power from it. Once again, the recording will have no dynamics, and these will have to be added later.

I hope this helps.
Alan

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JerryPH
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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by JerryPH » Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:38 am

artelagro wrote:Matt, my apologies for temporarily taking over your post.
Once I manage to shrink the photos, all should become clear.
Jerry, you will soon be able to take the blindfold off. Be patient
Matt, you've got something up your sleeve, I am starting to know you a bit. ;)

Garth, now you have my attention too! <patient mode: ON> :)

Alan, nice addition!
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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Re: Can you get lessons in music tech or not really?

Post by Glenn » Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:04 am

I seem to remember there was a YouTube video or article somewhere where the rate of CC11 was being measured and if I remember well altered but I cannot for the life of me find it again. Maybe one of you has the search skills to locate it as it may help in the midi overload issue.
I just realised that this post is a negative knowledge contribution but I'll post it my way:)


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1) Ballone Burini 46C (4+5) cassotto (LMMH) 3/3 PA; 2) Accordiola Piano V (5+5) cassotto (LMMMH) 3/3 PA;
3) Roland FR8X; 4) Hohner Vox 4k (LMMH) 3/3 CBA

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