The First Ever Southern England Chromatic Button Accordion Rally
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Not a musician :)

Give us a clue - who, and where, are you?
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JerryPH
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by JerryPH » Sun Dec 25, 2016 8:39 pm

My Roland is not going to be my last one... well, that depends, is having 59 completely different sampled accordions, 250 orchestral sounds and 15 drum sets enough? Wait, I need to install one more expansion set and add another 12 accordions and 25 orchestral instruments... lol
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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debra
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by debra » Sun Dec 25, 2016 8:54 pm

JerryPH wrote:My Roland is not going to be my last one... well, that depends, is having 59 completely different sampled accordions, 250 orchestral sounds and 15 drum sets enough? Wait, I need to install one more expansion set and add another 12 accordions and 25 orchestral instruments... lol
Whether 59 different sampled accordions and maybe 12 more is enough really depends... on whether there is the one sound among them that you really want. For instance, can you make the Roland sound just like your Morino? (I don't know whether you would want that though.)
The OP is happy to get any accordion sound but is likely to become more critical over time... That is something that can turn playing the accordion into a very expensive hobby (as I know first hand).
Paul De Bra (not Debra...)
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JerryPH
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by JerryPH » Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:09 pm

Can I do that now? Nope, but I likely could do it in the future. Someone already did a pretty good Gola sound as well as a few others like a Super VI. :)

That said, would the 8x ever be in the same class as my Morino? No, there is zero chance of that, even if it sounded 100% the same. The Roland is in it's own section far away from the real world of acoustics, no matter how many sounds it has.

Honestly, my feelings are that if you bought any digital accordion based on how perfectly it can imitate another accordion, that's a huge mistake. You have to enjoy it for what it does and what it offers, not what it can mimic. My Morino opened the door to the world of classical music for me, and I have a feeling that the 8x is going to open the door to other worlds for me and at the same time, force me to better my showmanship. For me, that's a good thing. :)

I have many hobbies, but even as a beginner or intermediate, I *always* went the route of professional tools even if I wasn't at that level, because it would inspire me to rise to the challenge faster and get better quicker than the person that for example, went through 5 different accordions before he found his "last one". I was the guy that had his "last one" way earlier and I grew in to it. I'll grow in to the 8x, even at my advanced stage of life. ;)

But... that's me, and certainly not everyone is like that (thank-goodness... lol)
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by RodionGork » Mon Dec 26, 2016 10:00 am

experienced the weird three light-switches between toilet and bathroom, the rightmost being the switch for the kitchen (took a while to figure this out, not having a light-switch in the kitchen itself)
Oh yes, I have no idea why, but this custom looks to have so deep roots that even newer buildings still are affected - often adding to this mess the 4-th switch for light in the hall (corridor). E.g. in my new appts the kitchen light switch is located 3 meters away, near the entrance door. The only advantage in this I feel when trying to get to kitchen in the night. In all other respects it is quite puzzling - to remember switch assignments...
If there is a deal for a good Bayan, I would say definitely go for it.
Well... I was thinking about it - mainly for it seems easier to transpose tunes (compared to piano-keyboard)... However I preferred to start with piano accordion simply because I have basic acquaintance with piano keys and thought this may speed up getting used to instrument.

But you made me think again. Well, it's decided now - I'll try bayan as soon as I feel confident with left hand :)
If you are at the level of having trouble of combining both left and right hands, keep on using the accordion you have now. All accordions are good for that purpose!
Yeah, the words of wisdom! :) It was just what I thought.

Meanwhile I succeeded in improving the tuning of the most notes of right keyboard. The main "feature" of this old instrument, which, probably, affects my practice - is that it devours enormous amount of air for bass / chords (as it seems to me).
It seems to have 5 "voices" in the left part (see picture below), and on some (perhaps, many) of them leather valves (what do we call them?) are not closing holes well. Though the device holds the air well when no left buttons are pressed. I've tried to fix the valves yesterday, so we'll see... Perhaps I can disable one of the voices... or even two. It is roaring very nicely but bit too loud.

Image

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debra
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by debra » Mon Dec 26, 2016 11:34 am

The first thing to do is always the valves. The pictures show that the valves are in pretty bad shape. They should all be flush against the reed plates, both on the inside (inside the reed block) and on the outside. They are less likely to be very bad on the inside, and that means that when you pull the notes will be more or less ok. But the valves on the outside are so far open that they are unlikely to be sucked close when you push, and that causes the notes to sound sharp (=too high) when you push. You should not have started tuning the reeds before fixing the valve issue. In almost all cases notes on an accordion that are seriously out of tune are so because of bad valves. A note may go slightly out of tune because of ageing but almost never seriously out of tune. The effect of the notes all being higher on push than on pull is caused entirely by the valves staying open.
A second effect of the valves staying open is that the accordion uses much more air than it should. This is most noticeable on the bass side as more air already goes through the bass side with valves properly closed, but even more air when they stay open.
Paul De Bra (not Debra...)
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RodionGork
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by RodionGork » Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:14 pm

You should not have started tuning the reeds before fixing the valve issue. In almost all cases notes on an accordion that are seriously out of tune are so because of bad valves.
Yes, I regretfully learned this only after the first attempt of tuning :)

I noticed that on gentle push the key gives one pitch, then, if pressed harder, the light "clap" is heard - the valve closes - and the pitch changes.

So this weekend I detached almost all of them, tried to re-bend them and glued again (with the nail-art lacquer, sorry). The photo was taken couple of weeks ago. Now I succeeded in tuning half of the right notes.

However I'm curious whether I can buy a piece of leather or something like this, to replace them completely? Or some different material should be used?
A note may go slightly out of tune because of ageing
The main cause of going out of tune in my case, I've found, is that some reeds have got stains of rust :( Luckily not many of them.

Also some upper notes (which have no valves, I think, by design) are significantly missing the tune even without rust. I may guess they were not ideally tuned, perhaps, since the beginning...

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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by EMan » Mon Dec 26, 2016 1:28 pm

Welcome to the forum RodionGork ! This is the best place on the globe to get the best all around info on all types of accordions, as you can see by the responses to your thread. (you will need to do some filtering tho). I, personally, like acoustic accordions; but I'm an old guy ( 69 tomorrow) and can't seem to wrap my arms around midis and Rolands. Not that they don't make great sound; it's just not for me at this time. Ironic, my Borsini has a top line MIDI on it that I have never used. LOL!

Second, your wife plays a mean fiddle and I happen to like Czardis by Monti; great tune and great video. I do an arrangement of this tune on my PA !

I hope your time here is productive and you derive the information that you are looking for; and maybe in the process become the accordionist that you hope to be!

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RodionGork
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by RodionGork » Tue Dec 27, 2016 9:04 am

Thanks a lot for your friendly words :)

As soon as I disassembled my first accordion I feel I love acoustic devices too :) It's just a pleasure to see how such things are made - so simple that I can understand every detail by and by - and on the other hand, with the mark of technical genius, because the things work so finely even many decades after they were created (ok, it probably will be finer when I get through cleanup / tuning procedure at last). Though when my various friends ask about choosing a piano, I'm a strong proponent of digital devices. Probably because pianos are much more frequently out of tune... :)
( 69 tomorrow)
Hah! Congrats on this day! Looking at my colleagues in US and a few internet friends there (e.g. from chess sites) I came to conclusion that many US people really never get "old" and remain surprisingly active and creative despite of the "official" age. So my best wishes to you! :)
like Czardis by Monti; great tune and great video. I do an arrangement of this tune on my PA !
[/quote][/quote]
Hm-m-m... I wonder, if you by chance record the video (or at least sound track) in sync with this one, then probably we can have fun of combining them together (probably, cutting me out of the scene) :lol:

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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by JeffJetton » Wed Dec 28, 2016 4:58 pm

Hmmm... you know some chords on a guitar and can squeeze out a few notes on accordion?

I hate to break it to you, but you are a musician. :-)

Maybe not yet as good a musician as you'd like to be. Maybe not yet a professional. But a musician nonetheless. Embrace it!

(And yes, accordion and violin do sound great together. My wife is a violinist too, and we play all sorts of stuff.)

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JerryPH
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Re: Not a musician :)

Post by JerryPH » Wed Dec 28, 2016 5:42 pm

Good points all Jeff! :)
My musical memoires blog/website: http://www.AccordionMemories.com

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